I am afraid my answer below will have to be lengthy. You have now been
given proper warning, ye here enter... ;-)
Post by A BPost by Kjell PetterssonIf you do not apply planets to houses, you will end up making a very
generalized interpretation valid for everyone born the same day, more
or less. Birthday astrology. The ascendant is the individualizing
factor, and so, consequently, are the houses.
True. Houses are vital, of course, but I just thought the particular way
"Saturn rules houses six and seven, servants and enemies. Example of a
servant could be the technical stuff that helps the moderators, that
is, the robomoderator. We have had technical problems recently, so I
do not rule out that the aspect you have mentioned may have to do with
that. However, aside from that Saturn rather rules the (open) enemies
of the group than the group itself, and it certainly does not rule the
Charter."
Saturn may be about rules, but it is not the Charter Planet, and, in
my view, certainly not in this chart.
I'll answer with a parallell, and an example:
If you want to find out about a person's mother, you can look at the
placement of the Moon (and Venus) in a chart. That, however, would
only give you a very general idea, as what you see would apply to
every chart from that particular hour, regardless of where on the
planet the person was born.
To get more information on the mother, you would have to look at the
tenth house of the native, and the ruler of that house.
And my example.
When my mother passed away, there were no specific aspects to the Moon
of my natal chart. I have MC in Pisces and the eight house of THAT
house is my fifth, having its cusp in Libra. That is, my mother and
the events surrounding her death would be ruledin MY chartby Jupiter
and Venus. (Let us for this example disregard Neptune as a modern co-
ruler.)
Looking into my progressed chart there was a precise opposition
between Venus and Jupiter active when she passed away. The midpoint of
natal Venus and Jupiter, again, in MY chart, was also activated at the
time.
So if I want to learn more things about the mother, I look to the
tenth house. More specifically, if I want to look at some particular
perspective I will have to do so. There is no planet that always and
in general indicates the death of the mother in ANY chart. Not even
Saturn would fulfill that function. In a chart where he rules the
tenth house he would rather symbolize her life force (or similar),
being the derived Ascendant.
Back to where you quoted me; there is no planet that stands for
technical difficulties. To arrive at conclusions regarding such, one
has to look beyond planets qua agents. A planet as a ruler does not
work in the same direct manner as it does when it is an agent.
As a ruler, a planet may show its influence within the whole range of
expression given it by sign and house. That is, an influence on Saturn
must not affect the robomoderator specifically but could show itself
in any number of situations related to the sixth house. None of these
situations include the Charter, though. Not unless Mars, the IC or
planets in the foundational house become involved.
There is a rulethat I unfortunately do not remember the origin of
that says that if the ruler of the Ascendant is either of Mars or
Saturn, neither is an infortune to the native. They COULD not be,
ruling the Ascendant. This, in my opinion, would work with derived
charts as well. In the aamod chart, the more Saturnian the servant,
the better it works. In the aamod chart, being Saturnian is inherent
in the nature of what the servant is about, the robomoderator being a
case in point. Being Saturnian is the very function of the
robomoderator.
In this chart, the natural ruler of servants, Mercury, could not be
connected specifically with the robomoderator.
I could go on at length, but I'll go on with your post and then we'll
see if you have any questions on the above. I could elaborate from
these if so. And let it also be said that I have somewhat exaggerated
the difference between agent and ruler, and between general and
specific, to be able to clearly make the point I want to make. For
instance, Mercury Rx could certainly affect the robomoderator,
regardless of whether or not it has a direct link in this particular
chart.
Post by A B"In modern astrology Neptune rules, or co-rules, Pisces. But with
Jupiter in Pisces, personally I think a possible influence from
Neptune over Pisces and the eight house can be disregarded. Still, the
eight house does not have to do with the Charter either." (as a definition
of what Neptune represents in a.a.mod's chart.)
I'll explain this quote separately. (An interesting way to argue,
where you make me sort of argue with my own words instead of providing
arguments of your own!)
Post by A BMyself, I'd simply have taken Saturn to represent what it normally
represents - rules and regulations, restrictions, structures, and so forth.
Then you would interpret every chart of every person born on the same
hour, even if continents apart, the same way. The houses differentiate
and individualize the chart and I see no way to disregard this without
the interpretation suffering from it.
Post by A BYou seemed to be attaching more importance to its house rulership than to
its basic definition.
I do no such a thing. You seem to cling to the idea that Saturn, by
standing for rules, would have to stand for all rules and everywhere.
That is not so. The kind of rules that make up a charter has a special
function; they make up a foundation. Foundations are ruled by the
fourth house, and thus we will have to look at that house and its
ruler(s) to learn more about the particular charter we discuss. I
would say that this is elementary. You cannot disregard function.
Post by A Battach more importance to its house rulership than to
its basic definition] with all charts, or is it
just this one? If so, why does this chart call for it particularly?
Again, I do not such a thing. Either you consciously misrepresent me,
or you do not understand what I say.
The basic definition of what Saturn is like is helpful with regards to
interpreting what it is about in THIS chart. In THIS chart Saturn
rules, for instance, the sixth house. Thus we know that servants and
slaves are of a Saturnian nature. The robomoderator is en excellent
example, being a machine and entirely driven by a set of rules. The
natural ruler of servants, Mercury, does not rule servants in this
chart. Not at all.
We can go on and make that interpretation even more specific, taking
into consideration the sign placement and aspects of Saturn, and its
ruler, but to see what impact it has in THIS chart, we must look at
what is has any power over. Had the sixth house intercepted the Saturn-
ruled signs, we would have had a very different picture than we have
now. Saturn would still act through aspecting other agents/planets in
the chart, but these actions would have no resonance. Imagine what
its body does to a drum, and how more full and defined the sound of a
drum becomes through having a confined space in which to reverberate.
Post by A B(Not
meaning to criticise, just curious).
To offer critique is not against the Charter. Nor am I offended by it.
I prefer to think of myself as capable of handling it.
/K